Back in August, the Young family was riding the subway in New York City when they were harassed by a group of teenage girls. The incident was caught on camera by another passenger and posted on Instagram. Within twenty four hours, the video went viral, with many people all around the world reacting with racist comments and misinformation about what happened and who was at fault. While the public and media were quick to conclude the incident was a hate crime, the Young family claims it was not a hate crime.
Months after the event occurred Sue and Ken Young sat down with our Director of Communications, Rose Lee, to discuss how they navigated the incident and the public response. They also talked about their vision for accountability and why they did not call for incarceration. Keep reading for their conversation.
The following transcript has been edited for clarity.
Rose: When the media approached you for an interview, why did you decide to speak out on the incident?
Sue: First and foremost, we wanted to bring awareness to the situation. But the second issue was because we wanted to make sure that the narrative was being presented correctly.
When we had done the first interview and looked at the Instagram video […], the comments that were being made were very difficult to swallow, and I think between my husband and I, we really didn’t want to fan the flame. We want to actually extinguish this and try to come to a common ground to help people understand that this is really a community wide issue — that we need to work together to try and fix this together.
“More hate is going to create more of these issues. I think that’s where it starts. It’s, oh, well, you know, you did this to me, now I need to do it back to you. Then we get into this terrible cycle of escalation, where we need to actually de-escalate everything.”
Sue Young
Ken: There’s a lot of racial hatred out there in the comments. We’re not on Instagram, but we heard that there was just a lot of mudslinging and mean and nasty things being said on both sides. Asian communities and Black communities have their different opinions, and there’s a lot of history there, but we did not want this incident to be something that worsened race relations.
They did not set out to attack Asian people in the subway that night, and we wanted to make that known because the angle the media was pursuing just stirred up more hate and we wanted to try to control that if possible.
Sue: More hate is going to create more of these issues. I think that’s where it starts. It’s, oh, well, you know, you did this to me, now I need to do it back to you. Then we get into this terrible cycle of escalation, where we need to actually de-escalate everything.
Rose: Originally this case was being investigated as a hate crime, why do you feel like it was important to emphasize that this was not a hate crime?
Sue: If we kept it as a hate crime, it would have escalated. I think people wanted to categorize it [as a hate crime] so that way it would be easy to hate more. If we were able to diffuse it and say, hey, there’s accountability in all of us, and not just this one race. It broadens things and it’ll bring more discussion instead of just mudslinging and being mad at one another.
Ken: That’s the last thing that we want — for there to be more animosity and hatred in the community, more conflict between Asian and Black communities resulting in someone else getting hurt. That would be the worst possible result.
Rose: You talked a little bit about accountability; in an ideal world, what do you think accountability should look like in this situation given what happened?
Sue: It’s not necessarily punishment that we’re looking for. We’re not looking for incarceration and we’re not looking to hurt them back. I look more in terms of rehabilitating. They’re very young girls. They are just starting their life. They can still do positive things and be good people in this world.
Ken: We told [the prosecutor] that we would like to see some good come of this for them to learn and change for the better, because we all know that just throwing them in jail would not fix anything.
Rose: It’s extraordinary that you have been so vocal about the need for alternative solutions outside of incarceration and condemning the anti-Black responses that have come on social media in response to what you all went through. Did you find it hard to speak out?
Ken: What I found really difficult was there were friends and family members and people that made it very clear that they wanted us to throw the book at the assailant and to make sure she rots in jail for as long as possible. They told us that in no uncertain terms, and they were even angry at us for not feeling that way. That was the hardest thing to deal with, to have our dear friends and family be so opposed to our message. We also have many others, I mean the majority that spoke to us and were very supportive of our views.
It was surprising and difficult to have some people that we’re pretty close to be so much against us, and be angry at us for wanting to spread our positive message and tone down the hate.
Rose: Where do you think that comes from?
Sue: They thought they were protecting us and the Asian community. Their concern is that by not punishing them, these girls will come out and do it again and that’s not what we want. We know historically, going to jail is not a good way of rehabilitating. It’s not going to change the situation, especially for a young person.
“Just as more guns are not the answer to gun violence, more hate is not the answer to racial hatred.”
Ken Young
Ken: This case is about more than just us and the assailant. It’s really about the broader Asian and Black communities and race relations — not even just in New York. This story has made international headlines, so we wanted to get the message out there that more hate is not the answer. Just as more guns are not the answer to gun violence, more hate is not the answer to racial hatred.
Sue: I think that as a community, as all communities, we need to stand up and say: This is not okay. I would have loved it if the entire train stood up and said to the girls, hey, that’s not okay. I think collectively as a community, if we stood up and said, you know what this isn’t okay. We need to change our behavior, and we hold them accountable. That’s stronger than all the community service and hours that we can ask these girls to do. I think holding each other accountable and having expectations of everybody and coming to each other’s aid as well will make a bigger difference than what we’re trying to accomplish through the court system and incarceration.
Rose: Coming out of this experience, how do you think different communities can work together to prevent hate and harassment, particularly between different racial communities?
Sue: You know, I was thinking about that, and that’s part of the reason why I wanted a moderated meeting with the assailants, with the girls, I mean, really, I shouldn’t be calling them assailants. They’re girls! I want them to see me as a mom. I want to see them as kids and ask them what their favorite colors are and what they like to do. I think if we know each other beyond just the face and their actions on video, we’ll have a better understanding.
You see, all these people who are so willing to rant and just excoriate each other online. It’s easy, because we’re hidden behind a screen. But if we were to go out, meet each other, actually interact, and work on something together, then I think it’d be easier for us to join together and unify. What if we had a unified cause? I think there needs to be more overlap instead of, okay, it’s just Asians that are trying to protect the Asians. I think we need to have everybody protecting each other and everybody coming together.
Rose: We have a lot of shared experiences throughout history, with racism and discrimination and our rights being taken away. There’s a lot of commonality that I think gets lost when issues get boiled down to such black and white terms. Is there anything else that you want to share with the broader public and Asian community?
Sue and Ken: We need to kind of stamp out the hate. Peace, love, and kindness, not hate. We’re all in it together. We’re all humans. We all share the same struggles.
Q&A: Asian American family harassed on NYC subway calls for community-centered response